How to delete most mail from my email servers.

[micky]

I'll give you the details later, but how do I delete all my email from
all four servers I use except what came in the last 24 or 48 hours?

I used to have a program that would do this, but I don't even remember
its name.


What program will do this, preferably without actually dl'ing the email
first?



I'm a Eudora user and it will delete everything, but that will delete
mail I've gotten in the last 24 hours.

[micky]

In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Sat, 31 Oct 2020 16:42:32 -0400, micky

Post by micky
I'll give you the details later, but how do I delete all my email from
all four servers I use except what came in the last 24 or 48 hours?
I used to have a program that would do this, but I don't even remember
its name.

***

Post by micky
What program will do this, preferably without actually dl'ing the email
first?
I'm a Eudora user and it will delete everything, but that will delete
mail I've gotten in the last 24 hours.

I think I panicked. Eudora itself will download all the headers,
headers only, to the Inbox, and I can delete, set the server status to
delete, what I want from there. Even though there are thousands. It
will be easy enough to tell the old ones from the new ones because of
where the date changes back to June or July, if sorting is not on on the
inbox.

I had in mind a program which would just look at the server and create a
one-line entry on my screen.

***I did Google and I didn't find the program I used to have. What a
shame. I lost it in a crash when I didn't keep enough backups. I'm sure
it would still work. FWIW, I think all of what it did Eudora will do
now, but didn't know how to do 25 years ago.

This page gave 5 suggestions.
https://www.raymond.cc/blog/manually-delete-pop3-emails-without-accessing-webmail-or-using-email-client/
And this gives one or two.
http://www.radarhill.com/help/article/remove-mail-from-server-outlook

[knuttle]

Post by micky
In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Sat, 31 Oct 2020 16:42:32 -0400, micky

Post by micky
I'll give you the details later, but how do I delete all my email from
all four servers I use except what came in the last 24 or 48 hours?
I used to have a program that would do this, but I don't even remember
its name.

***

Post by micky
What program will do this, preferably without actually dl'ing the email
first?
I'm a Eudora user and it will delete everything, but that will delete
mail I've gotten in the last 24 hours.

I think I panicked. Eudora itself will download all the headers,
headers only, to the Inbox, and I can delete, set the server status to
delete, what I want from there. Even though there are thousands. It
will be easy enough to tell the old ones from the new ones because of
where the date changes back to June or July, if sorting is not on on the
inbox.
I had in mind a program which would just look at the server and create a
one-line entry on my screen.
***I did Google and I didn't find the program I used to have. What a
shame. I lost it in a crash when I didn't keep enough backups. I'm sure
it would still work. FWIW, I think all of what it did Eudora will do
now, but didn't know how to do 25 years ago.
This page gave 5 suggestions.
https://www.raymond.cc/blog/manually-delete-pop3-emails-without-accessing-webmail-or-using-email-client/
And this gives one or two.
http://www.radarhill.com/help/article/remove-mail-from-server-outlook

You did not say what email servers you are using. However I use the ATT
Yahoo server, at one time when you downloaded your messages they were
removed from the server. Today instead of being removed, they are
moved to trash on the ATT Yahoo server.

The also collect any email you send even from it is from the email
program on your computer.

Now, every couple of days I go in and delete the trash, all of the sent
messages, and the spam from the ATT Yahoo server. There is no need to
keep them on my computer and expose them to hackers on the server.
(Yes I am old fashioned but that is the way I am.)

[micky]

The problem of too many emails is solved, but the next thread by me,
soon to come, will show how the problem started in Windows, not Eudora,
and I would like to understand that and keep it from happening again.

More below.

In comp.mail.eudora.ms-windows, on Sat, 31 Oct 2020 17:51:01 -0400,

Post by knuttle

Post by micky
In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Sat, 31 Oct 2020 16:42:32 -0400, micky

Post by micky
I'll give you the details later, but how do I delete all my email from
all four servers I use except what came in the last 24 or 48 hours?
I used to have a program that would do this, but I don't even remember
its name.

***

Post by micky
What program will do this, preferably without actually dl'ing the email
first?
I'm a Eudora user and it will delete everything, but that will delete
mail I've gotten in the last 24 hours.

I think I panicked. Eudora itself will download all the headers,
headers only, to the Inbox,

Shift/Fetch Mail and choose Fetch all message headers to the In mailbox.

Also uncheck the first two: Retrieve Mail and Send Queued Messages.

Post by knuttle

Post by micky
and I can delete, set the server status to
delete, what I want from there. Even though there are thousands. It
will be easy enough to tell the old ones from the new ones because of
where the date changes back to June or July, if sorting is not on on the
inbox.

In my head, this didn't work as well as I thought it would.

I used it for two servers, gmail and I forget the other one, to get all
their headers, and I changed the server status to Delete for all of
them, but then I had doubts which would happen first, the deletion or
the general downloading. Now I realize (and even maybe remember) that
deleting is done first, because it couldn't work right any other way.
For the same reason I had.

Nevertheless I switched to Delete all Messages that have been Retrieved,
and di this for the two remaining servers, and maybe the first two also.

It seemed to work for gmail, erols/RCN, and Verizon, but though I tried
it 2 or 3 times for Fastmail, I still had 5000 emails to dl each time I
did normal downloading. These two times, I was able to right (or left?)
click on the Yin Yang and stop the downloading. Then I used the filter
report to find all the mailboxes that received mail, I went to them and
deleted everything at the bottom that started on June 6th.

BTW, THIS IS A REALLY GOOD REASON TO LEAVE ALL YOUR MAILBOXES *NOT*
SORTING, so that you can find the duplicate downloads. They are all at
the bottom when you have sorting turned off. This has happened other
times too for different reasons.

So I went to Fastmail webmail and deleted all but the ones for today
that I hadn't gotten yet, and that did it. And I checked the webmail
for the other three, and two them, Erols/RCN and Verizon on AOL, seem to
have already had their old emails deleted by what I did above.

But gmail still had 176 emails, from 2018 to Oct 1 of thise year, even
though Eudora had Gmail was even stranger. Even after I "Deleted all
messages that have been retrieved", gmail shows 146 emails in my inbox,
the most recent is Oct 1 and going back to 9/14/2018. But in Eudora,
there are 21 emails after Oct 1 (and though it's irrelevant, 141
altoghether) but the server status is blank for all of them, every email
in the mailbox. I don't think this is because I'm using stunnel for
gmail, but I've queued an email for my gmail account, and I'll send it
when I'm ready to connect to the internet.

But how are there 21 emails in Eudora that are not on the server, when
older ones are on the server?

Post by knuttle

Post by micky
I had in mind a program which would just look at the server and create a
one-line entry on my screen.
***I did Google and I didn't find the program I used to have. What a
shame. I lost it in a crash when I didn't keep enough backups. I'm sure
it would still work. FWIW, I think all of what it did Eudora will do
now, but didn't know how to do 25 years ago.
This page gave 5 suggestions.
https://www.raymond.cc/blog/manually-delete-pop3-emails-without-accessing-webmail-or-using-email-client/
And this gives one or two.
http://www.radarhill.com/help/article/remove-mail-from-server-outlook

You did not say what email servers you are using. However I use the ATT

Erols/RCN, Verizon on AOL, Gmail, and Fastmail.

Post by knuttle
Yahoo server, at one time when you downloaded your messages they were
removed from the server. Today instead of being removed, they are
moved to trash on the ATT Yahoo server.
The also collect any email you send even from it is from the email
program on your computer.

That might be good. Then if you are away from your computer, you can
still look at what you've sent. Though in 25 years I've never had any
desire to do that.

Post by knuttle
Now, every couple of days I go in and delete the trash, all of the sent
messages, and the spam from the ATT Yahoo server. There is no need to
keep them on my computer and expose them to hackers on the server.
(Yes I am old fashioned but that is the way I am.)

I don't blame you. I don't even like giving phone numbers or backup
email addresses to my own email providers. And so far it's worked
well. Except for that yacht they tell me I bought in Santa Barbara and
the estate they tell me I bought in Tahiti, no one has hacked me.

[knuttle]

Post by micky
The problem of too many emails is solved, but the next thread by me,
soon to come, will show how the problem started in Windows, not Eudora,
and I would like to understand that and keep it from happening again.
More below.
In comp.mail.eudora.ms-windows, on Sat, 31 Oct 2020 17:51:01 -0400,

Post by knuttle

Post by micky
In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Sat, 31 Oct 2020 16:42:32 -0400, micky

Post by micky
I'll give you the details later, but how do I delete all my email from
all four servers I use except what came in the last 24 or 48 hours?
I used to have a program that would do this, but I don't even remember
its name.

***

Post by micky
What program will do this, preferably without actually dl'ing the email
first?
I'm a Eudora user and it will delete everything, but that will delete
mail I've gotten in the last 24 hours.

I think I panicked. Eudora itself will download all the headers,
headers only, to the Inbox,

Shift/Fetch Mail and choose Fetch all message headers to the In mailbox.
Also uncheck the first two: Retrieve Mail and Send Queued Messages.

Post by knuttle

Post by micky
and I can delete, set the server status to
delete, what I want from there. Even though there are thousands. It
will be easy enough to tell the old ones from the new ones because of
where the date changes back to June or July, if sorting is not on on the
inbox.

In my head, this didn't work as well as I thought it would.
I used it for two servers, gmail and I forget the other one, to get all
their headers, and I changed the server status to Delete for all of
them, but then I had doubts which would happen first, the deletion or
the general downloading. Now I realize (and even maybe remember) that
deleting is done first, because it couldn't work right any other way.
For the same reason I had.
Nevertheless I switched to Delete all Messages that have been Retrieved,
and di this for the two remaining servers, and maybe the first two also.
It seemed to work for gmail, erols/RCN, and Verizon, but though I tried
it 2 or 3 times for Fastmail, I still had 5000 emails to dl each time I
did normal downloading. These two times, I was able to right (or left?)
click on the Yin Yang and stop the downloading. Then I used the filter
report to find all the mailboxes that received mail, I went to them and
deleted everything at the bottom that started on June 6th.
BTW, THIS IS A REALLY GOOD REASON TO LEAVE ALL YOUR MAILBOXES *NOT*
SORTING, so that you can find the duplicate downloads. They are all at
the bottom when you have sorting turned off. This has happened other
times too for different reasons.
So I went to Fastmail webmail and deleted all but the ones for today
that I hadn't gotten yet, and that did it. And I checked the webmail
for the other three, and two them, Erols/RCN and Verizon on AOL, seem to
have already had their old emails deleted by what I did above.
But gmail still had 176 emails, from 2018 to Oct 1 of thise year, even
though Eudora had Gmail was even stranger. Even after I "Deleted all
messages that have been retrieved", gmail shows 146 emails in my inbox,
the most recent is Oct 1 and going back to 9/14/2018. But in Eudora,
there are 21 emails after Oct 1 (and though it's irrelevant, 141
altoghether) but the server status is blank for all of them, every email
in the mailbox. I don't think this is because I'm using stunnel for
gmail, but I've queued an email for my gmail account, and I'll send it
when I'm ready to connect to the internet.
But how are there 21 emails in Eudora that are not on the server, when
older ones are on the server?

Post by knuttle

Post by micky
I had in mind a program which would just look at the server and create a
one-line entry on my screen.
***I did Google and I didn't find the program I used to have. What a
shame. I lost it in a crash when I didn't keep enough backups. I'm sure
it would still work. FWIW, I think all of what it did Eudora will do
now, but didn't know how to do 25 years ago.
This page gave 5 suggestions.
https://www.raymond.cc/blog/manually-delete-pop3-emails-without-accessing-webmail-or-using-email-client/
And this gives one or two.
http://www.radarhill.com/help/article/remove-mail-from-server-outlook

You did not say what email servers you are using. However I use the ATT

Erols/RCN, Verizon on AOL, Gmail, and Fastmail.

Post by knuttle
Yahoo server, at one time when you downloaded your messages they were
removed from the server. Today instead of being removed, they are
moved to trash on the ATT Yahoo server.
The also collect any email you send even from it is from the email
program on your computer.

That might be good. Then if you are away from your computer, you can
still look at what you've sent. Though in 25 years I've never had any
desire to do that.

Post by knuttle
Now, every couple of days I go in and delete the trash, all of the sent
messages, and the spam from the ATT Yahoo server. There is no need to
keep them on my computer and expose them to hackers on the server.
(Yes I am old fashioned but that is the way I am.)

I don't blame you. I don't even like giving phone numbers or backup
email addresses to my own email providers. And so far it's worked
well. Except for that yacht they tell me I bought in Santa Barbara and
the estate they tell me I bought in Tahiti, no one has hacked me.

I will bet that is the one I bought ;-)


I have never had a problem with hacked emails.

I have freely given my emial to people in Places like Ancestry and to
genealogical correspondence and never had a problem

[micky]

In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Sat, 31 Oct 2020 19:39:05 -0400, knuttle

Post by knuttle

Post by micky

Post by knuttle
Now, every couple of days I go in and delete the trash, all of the sent
messages, and the spam from the ATT Yahoo server. There is no need to
keep them on my computer and expose them to hackers on the server.
(Yes I am old fashioned but that is the way I am.)

I don't blame you. I don't even like giving phone numbers or backup
email addresses to my own email providers. And so far it's worked
well. Except for that yacht they tell me I bought in Santa Barbara and
the estate they tell me I bought in Tahiti, no one has hacked me.

I will bet that is the one I bought ;-)

Then at least send me the address and a key so I can use it for a week
or two.

Post by knuttle
I have never had a problem with hacked emails.
I have freely given my emial to people in Places like Ancestry and to
genealogical correspondence and never had a problem

[Machiel de Wit]

micky schreef op 31-10-2020

Post by micky
I'll give you the details later, but how do I delete all my email
from all four servers I use except what came in the last 24 or 48
hours?
I used to have a program that would do this, but I don't even
remember its name.
What program will do this, preferably without actually dl'ing the
email first?
I'm a Eudora user and it will delete everything, but that will delete
mail I've gotten in the last 24 hours.

When you use POP3 in your email client, then set the advanced setting
to leave a copy on the server for x days.
All older mail is deleted after a pop run.

[Ajo Wissink]

On Sun, 01 Nov 2020 02:02:28 +0100, Machiel de Wit

Post by Machiel de Wit
micky schreef op 31-10-2020

Post by micky
I'll give you the details later, but how do I delete all my email
from all four servers I use except what came in the last 24 or 48
hours?
I used to have a program that would do this, but I don't even
remember its name.
What program will do this, preferably without actually dl'ing the
email first?
I'm a Eudora user and it will delete everything, but that will delete
mail I've gotten in the last 24 hours.

When you use POP3 in your email client, then set the advanced setting
to leave a copy on the server for x days.
All older mail is deleted after a pop run.

Yes, that is the usual solution. I leave my mail for 5 days on most of
the 11 servers I use.

Groeten uit Canada!

[micky]

In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Sun, 01 Nov 2020 02:02:28 +0100, Machiel

Post by Machiel de Wit
micky schreef op 31-10-2020

Post by micky
I'll give you the details later, but how do I delete all my email
from all four servers I use except what came in the last 24 or 48
hours?
I used to have a program that would do this, but I don't even
remember its name.
What program will do this, preferably without actually dl'ing the
email first?
I'm a Eudora user and it will delete everything, but that will delete
mail I've gotten in the last 24 hours.

When you use POP3 in your email client, then set the advanced setting
to leave a copy on the server for x days.
All older mail is deleted after a pop run.

FWIW, normally that's what I do. But my desktop computer broke, and I
was using the laptop, and planning to fix the desktop or get a new one
(and copy all the files from the old one's backup to the new one), so I
left everything on the server so that when the desktop was running
again, I could dl all the mail. As time wore on, it became bad that
newly dl'd mail would not indicate which emails had been replied to,
they wouldn't get labeled in different colors, and I'd have to delete
the ones I didn't want for the second time. (If there were only a
week's worth of email, that wouldn't be hard to process again, but 4
months was too much.)

So I moved all the laptop emails to the new desktop, but that still left
all the old emails on the servers.

[VanguardLH]

Post by micky
I'll give you the details later, but how do I delete all my email from
all four servers I use except what came in the last 24 or 48 hours?
I used to have a program that would do this, but I don't even remember
its name.
What program will do this, preferably without actually dl'ing the email
first?
I'm a Eudora user and it will delete everything, but that will delete
mail I've gotten in the last 24 hours.

Why not use the e-mail provider's webmail client to sort the e-mails in
whatever folders are there (standard ones plus any you created) to
delete anything older than 4 months?

[micky]

In comp.mail.eudora.ms-windows, on Sun, 1 Nov 2020 02:22:55 -0600,

Post by VanguardLH

Post by micky
I'll give you the details later, but how do I delete all my email from
all four servers I use except what came in the last 24 or 48 hours?
I used to have a program that would do this, but I don't even remember
its name.
What program will do this, preferably without actually dl'ing the email
first?
I'm a Eudora user and it will delete everything, but that will delete
mail I've gotten in the last 24 hours.

Why not use the e-mail provider's webmail client to sort the e-mails in
whatever folders are there (standard ones plus any you created) to
delete anything older than 4 months?

A very good idea. That's what I finally did, at least with fastmail.
Maybe I thought I'd have to check off each one of the 5000 instead of
All at once, and unchecking the ones I wanted to keep.

I think it was more than that. I wanted to undo whatever was happening
in Eudora. It has a Left Message on Server file, LMOS.dat, for each
server, that I thought I could manipulate, but eventually I learned it
didnt' work the way I'd speculated.

Eudora has a feature to "Delete from Server every email that is fully
downloaded". And that worked with 3 of the 4 servers, but not with
Fastmail. I tried 2 or 3 times and it had no effect, so I had to do
what you suggest above.

[VanguardLH]

Post by micky
In comp.mail.eudora.ms-windows, on Sun, 1 Nov 2020 02:22:55 -0600,

Post by VanguardLH

Post by micky
I'll give you the details later, but how do I delete all my email from
all four servers I use except what came in the last 24 or 48 hours?
I used to have a program that would do this, but I don't even remember
its name.
What program will do this, preferably without actually dl'ing the email
first?
I'm a Eudora user and it will delete everything, but that will delete
mail I've gotten in the last 24 hours.

Why not use the e-mail provider's webmail client to sort the e-mails in
whatever folders are there (standard ones plus any you created) to
delete anything older than 4 months?

A very good idea. That's what I finally did, at least with fastmail.
Maybe I thought I'd have to check off each one of the 5000 instead of
All at once, and unchecking the ones I wanted to keep.
I think it was more than that. I wanted to undo whatever was happening
in Eudora. It has a Left Message on Server file, LMOS.dat, for each
server, that I thought I could manipulate, but eventually I learned it
didnt' work the way I'd speculated.
Eudora has a feature to "Delete from Server every email that is fully
downloaded". And that worked with 3 of the 4 servers, but not with
Fastmail. I tried 2 or 3 times and it had no effect, so I had to do
what you suggest above.

If you used IMAP (instead of POP), you would see the same set of e-mails
on your old (laptop) and new (desktop) computers. You wouldn't have to
store them up to have them on another computer. Anytime you install an
IMAP client on any computer to connect to your account, it sees the same
folders and e-mails you saw on any other computer. Plus you could sync
on more folders than just the Inbox (POP has no concept of folders, just
knows the mailbox where IMAP can sync on any and all folders, including
those you add to organize your e-mails).

Also, an IMAP client can immediately notified when a new e-mail arrives
without a persistent network connection to the server whereas POP won't
know until its next polling interval (and polling at less than 5-minute
intervals is considered rude to the e-mail providers). Original Eudora
is pretty old, so I don't know how well it supports the PUSH (c.2006) or
IDLE (c.1997) extension protocols to IMAP. According to:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eudora_(email_client)

Eudora died around 2006 to become Thunderbird-based Eudora OSE which
also died around 2010. Both would've been late enough to adopt the IMAP
extensions, but whether that happened would be something maybe Eudora
[OSE] users would know. I trialed it for a very short time (original
and OSE versions), but decided not to waste my time and instead use
Thunderbird (which had several trials, the last one lasting 6 months,
but I dumped it, too).

POP polling can also run into problems when someone sends you a huge
e-mail, like they attached a video or file despite no e-mail protocol
was designed to equate to FTP (there's no CRC checking to check for
corruption during transit, there is no resume, and e-mail servers are
throttled to allocate resources to a vast number of concurrent users).
Your POP client polls your server, a session starts to slowly transfer
the huge e-mail, along comes the next polling interval while the huge
and slow transfer is still ongoing, the transfer gets interrupted to
start the next poll, the slow transfer starts all over again for the
huge e-mail (remember there is no resume for e-mail), and the cycle
keeps repeating on every poll that interrupts the ongoing slow transfer,
so your client gets stuck continually retrying to retrieve the same huge
e-mail.

I kept using POP until probably around 2000. I was stubborn, too, and
figured (near the end) that "Leave messages on server" was enough
IMAP-like for me (POP normally does RETR[ieve] followed by DEL[ete],
that that option had the client not send the DEL command after
RETRieving a message). After I started using IMAP, I didn't go back to
POP and changed all my account to IMAP. Back then, I had to wait for
some of my e-mail providers to add IMAP support (and for it to not be a
flaky implementation, like at Gmail and my ISP), but that was about 2
decades ago.

[micky]

In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Mon, 2 Nov 2020 02:29:40 -0600, VanguardLH

Post by VanguardLH
If you used IMAP (instead of POP), you would see the same set of e-mails

I think you and I have been over this before. I don't want to use
Imap, and this episode has no effect on my views about that.

Post by VanguardLH
on your old (laptop) and new (desktop) computers. You wouldn't have to
store them up to have them on another computer. Anytime you install an
IMAP client on any computer to connect to your account, it sees the same
folders and e-mails you saw on any other computer. Plus you could sync
on more folders than just the Inbox (POP has no concept of folders, just
knows the mailbox where IMAP can sync on any and all folders, including
those you add to organize your e-mails).
Also, an IMAP client can immediately notified when a new e-mail arrives
without a persistent network connection to the server whereas POP won't
know until its next polling interval (and polling at less than 5-minute
intervals is considered rude to the e-mail providers). Original Eudora
is pretty old, so I don't know how well it supports the PUSH (c.2006) or
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eudora_(email_client)
Eudora died around 2006

No, it didn't die. There are many people using it, including some in
corporate network settings.

Post by VanguardLH
to become Thunderbird-based Eudora OSE

And it did not become anything else. The OSE version is a different
program that uses the name Eurora, sort of like my nephew has the same
last name I do.

Post by VanguardLH
which
also died around 2010. Both would've been late enough to adopt the IMAP
extensions,

Eudora, the real one, has IMAP, but I'm not interested.

Post by VanguardLH
but whether that happened would be something maybe Eudora
[OSE] users would know. I trialed it for a very short time (original
and OSE versions), but decided not to waste my time and instead use
Thunderbird (which had several trials, the last one lasting 6 months,
but I dumped it, too).
POP polling can also run into problems when someone sends you a huge
e-mail, like they attached a video or file despite no e-mail protocol
was designed to equate to FTP (there's no CRC checking to check for
corruption during transit, there is no resume, and e-mail servers are
throttled to allocate resources to a vast number of concurrent users).
Your POP client polls your server, a session starts to slowly transfer
the huge e-mail, along comes the next polling interval while the huge
and slow transfer is still ongoing, the transfer gets interrupted to
start the next poll, the slow transfer starts all over again for the
huge e-mail (remember there is no resume for e-mail), and the cycle
keeps repeating on every poll that interrupts the ongoing slow transfer,
so your client gets stuck continually retrying to retrieve the same huge
e-mail.
I kept using POP until probably around 2000. I was stubborn, too, and

You may be stubborn, I don't know, but don't attribute your mindset to
others.

Post by VanguardLH
figured (near the end) that "Leave messages on server" was enough
IMAP-like for me (POP normally does RETR[ieve] followed by DEL[ete],
that that option had the client not send the DEL command after
RETRieving a message). After I started using IMAP, I didn't go back to
POP and changed all my account to IMAP. Back then, I had to wait for
some of my e-mail providers to add IMAP support (and for it to not be a
flaky implementation, like at Gmail and my ISP), but that was about 2
decades ago.

[VanguardLH]

Post by micky

Post by VanguardLH
Eudora died around 2006

No, it didn't die. There are many people using it, including some in
corporate network settings.

I still use 40tude Dialog as my NNTP client. That I use it does not
obviate that it died back in 2005. According to your criteria, nothing
is dead if anyone still uses it. Nope, Eudora died. If it's not dead,
just WHO is now its owner and developer? Who last updated it? No one,
because it died. Nothing prevents anyone from continuing to use a dead
program. There are lots of folks still using Windows XP, or even DOS.

Post by micky

Post by VanguardLH
to become Thunderbird-based Eudora OSE

And it did not become anything else. The OSE version is a different
program that uses the name Eurora, sort of like my nephew has the same
last name I do.

Post by VanguardLH
which also died around 2010. Both would've been late enough to adopt
the IMAP extensions,

Eudora, the real one, has IMAP, but I'm not interested.

I didn't say IMAP. I said IMAP *extensions*. Do YOU know that Eudora
supports IMAP IDLE and IMAP PUSH? Well, you wouldn't care because you
chose to stick with POP.

You cite a problem with your POP client redownloading all the messages
off the e-mail server. Then how you had to go through all the
machinations to delete all those old messages in a new instance of a POP
client. None of that is needed with IMAP. You proved why POP is a poor
choice.

[Piet]

Post by micky

Post by VanguardLH
Eudora died around 2006

No, it didn't die. There are many people using it, including some in
corporate network settings.

According to your criteria, nothing is dead if anyone still uses it.

That's correct. A dead horse isn't dead as long as you still can
ride it. It may even do a better job than today's dancing horses.

Nope, Eudora died. If it's not dead, just WHO is now its owner and
developer? Who last updated it? No one, because it died.

Nope, because development stopped.

Nothing prevents anyone from continuing to use a dead program.

Dead software can't be used. Eudora can.

-p

[Jim H]

Post by Piet

Post by micky

Post by VanguardLH
Eudora died around 2006

No, it didn't die. There are many people using it, including some in
corporate network settings.

According to your criteria, nothing is dead if anyone still uses it.

That's correct. A dead horse isn't dead as long as you still can
ride it. It may even do a better job than today's dancing horses.

Nope, Eudora died. If it's not dead, just WHO is now its owner and
developer? Who last updated it? No one, because it died.

Nope, because development stopped.

Nothing prevents anyone from continuing to use a dead program.

Dead software can't be used. Eudora can.

With the replacement Eudora's QCSSL file available from the Hermes
Project - a project aimed at making Eudora source code recompilable so
development can continue - any problems caused by server use of
different encryption than Eudora is capable of are solved. I don't
know of a single currently developed program I'd prefer over the old
Eudora, especially with the replacement QCSSL.dll.

Development on the old Eudora is dead, but the program is very much
alive.

[Piet]

Post by Jim H

Post by Piet

Nothing prevents anyone from continuing to use a dead program.

Dead software can't be used. Eudora can.

With the replacement Eudora's QCSSL file available from the Hermes
Project - a project aimed at making Eudora source code recompilable
so development can continue - any problems caused by server use of
different encryption than Eudora is capable of are solved.

I installed LIBEAY32.DLL, QCSSL.DLL, SSLEAY32.DLL and ROOTCERTS.P7B
to to Eudora program folder. They may not all be necessary, but it
works like a charm. Except for one server/client situation for the
mail folders, which I described in a long posting in this newsgroup.

Post by Jim H
I don't know of a single currently developed program I'd prefer
over the old Eudora, especially with the replacement QCSSL.dll.

Fully agreed.

Post by Jim H
Development on the old Eudora is dead, but the program is very much
alive.

And so are its users. ;-)

-p

[micky]

In comp.mail.eudora.ms-windows, on Tue, 3 Nov 2020 18:30:38 +0100, Piet

Post by Piet

Post by Jim H
Development on the old Eudora is dead, but the program is very much
alive.

And so are its users. ;-)

I plan to use it until I die, but not a day longer.

[Dennis Lee Bieber]

Post by micky
In comp.mail.eudora.ms-windows, on Tue, 3 Nov 2020 18:30:38 +0100, Piet

Post by Piet

Post by Jim H
Development on the old Eudora is dead, but the program is very much
alive.

And so are its users. ;-)

I plan to use it until I die, but not a day longer.

What?!

You don't have a watchdog program rigged to send out death notices if
you don't reset the timer periodically?

<G>


I suspect Eudora will run until we get 128-bit processors and a 128-bit
OS (which, if history is followed, will have a subsystem for running 64-bit
programs, but not 32-bit ones).

{Having said that, I have to confess that I've been using Pandora for
the last two years; it mostly looks like Eudora, but has some significant
differences. The HermSSL files had not been available at the time I
switched over}

[micky]

In comp.mail.eudora.ms-windows, on Wed, 04 Nov 2020 11:38:50 -0500,

Post by Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by micky
In comp.mail.eudora.ms-windows, on Tue, 3 Nov 2020 18:30:38 +0100, Piet

Post by Piet

Post by Jim H
Development on the old Eudora is dead, but the program is very much
alive.

And so are its users. ;-)

I plan to use it until I die, but not a day longer.

What?!
You don't have a watchdog program rigged to send out death notices if
you don't reset the timer periodically?
<G>

Grinning aside, I probably should have one of those. I live alone and
I'd hate to spend much time here dead.

Do you have a recommendation?

Post by Dennis Lee Bieber
I suspect Eudora will run until we get 128-bit processors and a 128-bit

But when you get one, I may not get one. Not only my software but my
hardware tends to be old.

Post by Dennis Lee Bieber
OS (which, if history is followed, will have a subsystem for running 64-bit
programs, but not 32-bit ones).
{Having said that, I have to confess that I've been using Pandora for
the last two years; it mostly looks like Eudora, but has some significant
differences. The HermSSL files had not been available at the time I
switched over}

I tried it. I even paid for it, so that it would import stuff. I can't
remember what happened next.

[Dennis Lee Bieber]

Post by micky
Grinning aside, I probably should have one of those. I live alone and
I'd hate to spend much time here dead.
Do you have a recommendation?

Sorry, no...

[Jim H]

On Wed, 04 Nov 2020 15:00:42 -0500, in

Post by micky
In comp.mail.eudora.ms-windows, on Wed, 04 Nov 2020 11:38:50 -0500,

Post by Dennis Lee Bieber
What?!
You don't have a watchdog program rigged to send out death notices if
you don't reset the timer periodically?
<G>

Grinning aside, I probably should have one of those. I live alone and
I'd hate to spend much time here dead.
Do you have a recommendation?

If you're worried about a body lying about, get a couple of cats.
They'll eat you.

[Dennis Lee Bieber]

Post by Jim H
If you're worried about a body lying about, get a couple of cats.
They'll eat you.

But will they notify the neighbors?

[Jim H]

On Sun, 08 Nov 2020 11:52:35 -0500, in

Post by Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by Jim H
If you're worried about a body lying about, get a couple of cats.
They'll eat you.

But will they notify the neighbors?

Probably not. They don't really care.

[Piet]

Post by Dennis Lee Bieber

Post by Jim H
If you're worried about a body lying about, get a couple
of cats. They'll eat you.

But will they notify the neighbors?

The smell would have notified them long before.

-p

[VanguardLH]

Oh, in addition, POP tracks no status on whether an e-mail had been
retrieved before. The server has no record of what you retrieved
before. It has no concept of old and new for status on a message. Your
POP client has to track old/new status by keeping a database of all
Message-IDs (MIDs) that it previously retrieved. It is up to the POP
client to know from the LIST command its sends and the list of MIDs the
server returns (of all messages in your account) which are the old MIDs,
so by process of elimination it knows which are the new MIDs. If the
POP client farks up its old MIDs list, it can end up re-retrieving some
or all messages from the server.

An IMAP server does track which messages your client previously
retrieved. The server tracks via a \Recent flag (for new messages) and
\Seen flag (for previously retrieved) messages. The IMAP client only
needs to get a list of new messages that are unseen (\seen flag not
set). Flags on the server saving status make it a lot easier for the
client to determine which are new messages that it has not previously
retrieved. Instead of issuing LIST to get a list of *all* messages in a
folder and then compare against its MIDs database of what it previously
retrieved, it can just ask the IMAP server which messages have not yet
been seen.

Eudora (even the OSE version) has no Unicode support. Also, since a lot
of e-mail providers have dropped SSL support (which was shown
vulnerable) and moved on to TLS, does Eudora (or Eudora OSE) support
TLS? Not only have they moved from SSL to TLS, they've moved from TLS
1.0, 1.1, and 1.2 to TLS 1.3. TLS 1.0 was no different than SSL 3.0,
except the handshaking process was sufficiently different to make them
incompatible encryption protocols, so TLS 1.0 was just as vulnerable as
SSL 3.0. Didn't take long for e-mail providers to dump TLS 1.0 and go
to TLS 1.1. Many now requires TLS 3.0 which wasn't ratified until 2018,
and which is long after both Eudora and Eudora OSE died. In addition, a
few years back, many ciphers were found weak or vulnerable, so e-mail
providers and web sites dropped them.

https://support.google.com/a/answer/9795993?hl=en

Eudora [OSE] likely still uses the defunct ciphers, so whether you can
use Eudora to connect to an e-mail provider depends on whether or not
they choose to support those old and deprecated ciphers. Using TLS 1.3
helps secure the handshaking to establish a connection, but your e-mail
is not (or less) secure if your client is still using a weak cipher to
encrypt your data.

https://electricenergyonline.com/energy/magazine/779/article/Security-Sessions-Exploring-Weak-Ciphers.htm

Microsoft dropped lots of weak ciphers, but still allowed fallback to
some less weak ciphers. There's no jumping forward from a client
requesting a discontinued cipher to a stronger one that is supported,
because the client has to support the stronger cipher, so it would
request that one, anyway. I think the big hit was around 2011 which hit
a lot of encrypting clients, like Internet Explorer 11 losing access to
the RC4 cipher that got dropped. You could hit an e-mail provider that
requires a minimum cipher strength, but your old client requests a weak
cipher from the OS that has not just been deprecated but discontinued.
It's not just the TLS 1.3 that might be demanded by an e-mail provider,
but a minimal cipher, too. Between moving to TLS 1.3 and stronger
ciphers, I've seen some users resort to using sTunnel as a proxy to add
TLS 1.3 and stronger cipher support. The client is configured NOT to
use encrypted connections to the accounts, it connects to sTunnel
instead of directly to the server, and sTunnel handles the handshaking
protocol and cipher that the server requires at a minimum. Last I used
sTunnel (with an e-mail client that got killed because it didn't support
TLS or less-weak ciphers), you had to manually edit some text
configuration files. You had to do that, anyway, to specify the input
port to which your e-mail client connected, and the server to which
sTunnel would connect for that input port. You defined the mapping, and
this made sTunnel a pain to use. There was no GUI to sTunnel, but I'm
not sure a GUI would facilitate using and configuring sTunnel.

[Dennis Lee Bieber]

Post by VanguardLH
Eudora (even the OSE version) has no Unicode support. Also, since a lot
of e-mail providers have dropped SSL support (which was shown
vulnerable) and moved on to TLS, does Eudora (or Eudora OSE) support
TLS? Not only have they moved from SSL to TLS, they've moved from TLS
1.0, 1.1, and 1.2 to TLS 1.3. TLS 1.0 was no different than SSL 3.0,
except the handshaking process was sufficiently different to make them
incompatible encryption protocols, so TLS 1.0 was just as vulnerable as
SSL 3.0. Didn't take long for e-mail providers to dump TLS 1.0 and go
to TLS 1.1. Many now requires TLS 3.0 which wasn't ratified until 2018,
and which is long after both Eudora and Eudora OSE died. In addition, a
few years back, many ciphers were found weak or vulnerable, so e-mail
providers and web sites dropped them.

https://sourceforge.net/projects/hermesmail/files/

The HermSSL.zip is a drop-in update for the Qualcomm Eudora SSL
libraries and root certificates.

[micky]

In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Mon, 2 Nov 2020 03:17:01 -0600, VanguardLH

Post by VanguardLH
Eudora (even the OSE version) has no Unicode support. Also, since a lot

Eudora, the real one, v7.1.0.9, does have Unicode support. There is a
Eudora plug-in, Message Viewer, that will read afaik anything in
Unicode. I've used it and it works well.


BTW, a couple years after Qualcomm gave up supporting Eudora, they gave
out a license number everyone and anyone can use, to use the latest
formerly paid version of Eudora. No advertising and all the features
(except an advanced faster sort function that they had licensed from
some other company. So they didn't own it and they couldn't give away
copies. But anyone who had bought a license can still use the X1 sort,
I think it's called. I have it buy my files are not enormous and I
don't use it.

Then a couple years ago, they released the source code and anyone can
have that too, to make changes or improvements.

Post by VanguardLH
of e-mail providers have dropped SSL support (which was shown
vulnerable) and moved on to TLS, does Eudora (or Eudora OSE) support
TLS? Not only have they moved from SSL to TLS, they've moved from TLS
1.0, 1.1, and 1.2 to TLS 1.3. TLS 1.0 was no different than SSL 3.0,
except the handshaking process was sufficiently different to make them
incompatible encryption protocols, so TLS 1.0 was just as vulnerable as
SSL 3.0. Didn't take long for e-mail providers to dump TLS 1.0 and go
to TLS 1.1. Many now requires TLS 3.0 which wasn't ratified until 2018,
and which is long after both Eudora and Eudora OSE died.

I guess at most you and I have different views of what die means.
Eudora did not die. I used it today and she was as spunky as ever.

As to encryption, stunnel handles all of Eudora's encryption needs.

There is also something called hermes but I don't know much about that.

Post by VanguardLH
In addition, a
few years back, many ciphers were found weak or vulnerable, so e-mail
providers and web sites dropped them.

[VanguardLH]

Post by micky

Post by VanguardLH
Eudora (even the OSE version) has no Unicode support.

Eudora, the real one, v7.1.0.9, does have Unicode support. There is
a Eudora plug-in, Message Viewer, that will read afaik anything in
Unicode. I've used it and it works well.

I said *Eudora* does not have Unicode support. Then you verify that
fact, but then try to deny that fact. Extensions or plug-ins add a
feature that the program does NOT have. Was the Message Viewer plug-in
written by the author of Eudora? If so, that would counter all the
articles that note Eudora has been long unsupported (aka dead).

Thunderbird from version 68, and earlier, had no e-mail encryption, but,
you can add an extension that adds that feature (e.g., Enigmail, not
free, subscriptionware). Extensions and plug-ins don't exist just to
duplicate the functionality already in the program they are to extend.
When Thunderbird added OpenPGP, the Enigmail extension became
superluous.

Post by micky
BTW, a couple years after Qualcomm gave up supporting Eudora, they gave
out a license number everyone and anyone can use, to use the latest
formerly paid version of Eudora.

Because they killed (discontinued) the product, didn't want anyone to
think they would get support, so gave out the product key to assuage all
those users. Yep, you get a key, but no support. It was nice they did
that, but they could've also provided a new version if for nothing other
than to remove the code that validates the product using a key. They
didn't even want to touch the code, just publish a global key which was
probably a lot easier for them.

Post by micky
Then a couple years ago, they released the source code and anyone can
have that too, to make changes or improvements.

Yep, to make sure no one thought they provided any support. They
divested themself of any responsibility for the product, or what it
might become.

Post by micky
As to encryption, stunnel handles all of Eudora's encryption needs.

Yeah, I mentioned that. It can be easy to setup, or a bitch depending
on what features of sTunnel you want to implement. You use sTunnel to
patch up a discontinued/abandoned/dead product to keep it usable as the
rest of the world moves on. If the program were maintained (not dead)
then sTunnel isn't needed (well, except for some of its other esoteric
uses).

I would have to do the same in using sTunnel with my long-dead 40tude
Dialog NNTP client if, for some I felt compelled to connect to an NNTP
that supported encryption (NNTPS). Since newsgroups are a public venue
for communication, I see no reason to encrypt my messages during
transport since they're obviously going to digestable by anyone visiting
any newsgroup to where a I submit. E-mail, however, usually has a
limited list of recipients, so it isn't intended for public consumption.

[micky]

In comp.mail.eudora.ms-windows, on Mon, 2 Nov 2020 23:00:09 -0600,

Post by VanguardLH

Post by micky

Post by VanguardLH
Eudora (even the OSE version) has no Unicode support.

Eudora, the real one, v7.1.0.9, does have Unicode support. There is
a Eudora plug-in, Message Viewer, that will read afaik anything in
Unicode. I've used it and it works well.

I said *Eudora* does not have Unicode support. Then you verify that
fact, but then try to deny that fact.

No, I didn't.

Post by VanguardLH
Extensions or plug-ins add a
feature that the program does NOT have.

They are still support.

If my father supports me, I'm supported. I have support.

Post by VanguardLH
Was the Message Viewer plug-in
written by the author of Eudora? If so, that would counter all the
articles that note Eudora has been long unsupported (aka dead).

Unsupported is not the same as dead. If you want to believe it is,
don't reply to my posts with that as an assumption. I may not have time
to correct you all the time.

Post by VanguardLH
Thunderbird from version 68, and earlier, had no e-mail encryption, but,
you can add an extension that adds that feature (e.g., Enigmail, not
free, subscriptionware). Extensions and plug-ins don't exist just to
duplicate the functionality already in the program they are to extend.
When Thunderbird added OpenPGP, the Enigmail extension became
superluous.

Post by micky
BTW, a couple years after Qualcomm gave up supporting Eudora, they gave
out a license number everyone and anyone can use, to use the latest
formerly paid version of Eudora.

Because they killed (discontinued)the product,

They did not discontinue the product. They discontinued development and
support of the product. Not at all the same thing.

And discontinuing their development and support is not at all the same
as killing. Try to understand that.

Post by VanguardLH
didn't want anyone to
think they would get support,

No,everyone knew that already.

Post by VanguardLH
so gave out the product key to assuage all
those users.

They did it because they are responsible, upstanding, and they didn't
want to see the product stop being used.

Post by VanguardLH
Yep, you get a key, but no support. It was nice they did
that, but they could've also provided a new version if for nothing other
than to remove the code that validates the product using a key.

6 of one, half a dozen of another.

Post by VanguardLH
They
didn't even want to touch the code, just publish a global key which was
probably a lot easier for them.

Sure. You touch the code, you may have to do a lot of testing to make
sure you didn't mess it up.

Post by VanguardLH

Post by micky
Then a couple years ago, they released the source code and anyone can
have that too, to make changes or improvements.

Yep, to make sure no one thought they provided any support. They

NO. EVERYONE KNEW THAT ALREADY.

Post by VanguardLH
divested themself of any responsibility for the product, or what it

Are you kidding? What responsibility do you imagine might have been
attributed to them. Have you read the terms and conditions? Do you knwo
how business works?

Post by VanguardLH
might become.

Post by micky
As to encryption, stunnel handles all of Eudora's encryption needs.

Yeah, I mentioned that. It can be easy to setup, or a bitch depending
on what features of sTunnel you want to implement. You use sTunnel to
patch up a discontinued/abandoned/dead product to keep it usable as the

That wasn't the case.

Post by VanguardLH
rest of the world moves on. If the program were maintained (not dead)
then sTunnel isn't needed

No. It depends what maintenance has been done.

I think you're just being annoying for the sake of being annoying.

Post by VanguardLH
(well, except for some of its other esoteric
uses).
I would have to do the same in using sTunnel with my long-dead 40tude
Dialog NNTP client if, for some I felt compelled to connect to an NNTP
that supported encryption (NNTPS). Since newsgroups are a public venue
for communication, I see no reason to encrypt my messages during
transport since they're obviously going to digestable by anyone visiting
any newsgroup to where a I submit. E-mail, however, usually has a
limited list of recipients, so it isn't intended for public consumption.

[VanguardLH]

Post by micky
In comp.mail.eudora.ms-windows, on Mon, 2 Nov 2020 23:00:09 -0600,

Post by VanguardLH

Post by micky

Post by VanguardLH
Eudora (even the OSE version) has no Unicode support.

Eudora, the real one, v7.1.0.9, does have Unicode support. There is
a Eudora plug-in, Message Viewer, that will read afaik anything in
Unicode. I've used it and it works well.

I said *Eudora* does not have Unicode support. Then you verify that
fact, but then try to deny that fact.

No, I didn't.

Post by VanguardLH
Extensions or plug-ins add a
feature that the program does NOT have.

They are still support.
If my father supports me, I'm supported. I have support.

Post by VanguardLH
Was the Message Viewer plug-in
written by the author of Eudora? If so, that would counter all the
articles that note Eudora has been long unsupported (aka dead).

Unsupported is not the same as dead. If you want to believe it is,
don't reply to my posts with that as an assumption. I may not have time
to correct you all the time.

Post by VanguardLH
Thunderbird from version 68, and earlier, had no e-mail encryption, but,
you can add an extension that adds that feature (e.g., Enigmail, not
free, subscriptionware). Extensions and plug-ins don't exist just to
duplicate the functionality already in the program they are to extend.
When Thunderbird added OpenPGP, the Enigmail extension became
superluous.

Post by micky
BTW, a couple years after Qualcomm gave up supporting Eudora, they gave
out a license number everyone and anyone can use, to use the latest
formerly paid version of Eudora.

Because they killed (discontinued)the product,

They did not discontinue the product. They discontinued development and
support of the product. Not at all the same thing.
And discontinuing their development and support is not at all the same
as killing. Try to understand that.

Post by VanguardLH
didn't want anyone to
think they would get support,

No,everyone knew that already.

Post by VanguardLH
so gave out the product key to assuage all
those users.

They did it because they are responsible, upstanding, and they didn't
want to see the product stop being used.

Post by VanguardLH
Yep, you get a key, but no support. It was nice they did
that, but they could've also provided a new version if for nothing other
than to remove the code that validates the product using a key.

6 of one, half a dozen of another.

Post by VanguardLH
They
didn't even want to touch the code, just publish a global key which was
probably a lot easier for them.

Sure. You touch the code, you may have to do a lot of testing to make
sure you didn't mess it up.

Post by VanguardLH

Post by micky
Then a couple years ago, they released the source code and anyone can
have that too, to make changes or improvements.

Yep, to make sure no one thought they provided any support. They

NO. EVERYONE KNEW THAT ALREADY.

Post by VanguardLH
divested themself of any responsibility for the product, or what it

Are you kidding? What responsibility do you imagine might have been
attributed to them. Have you read the terms and conditions? Do you knwo
how business works?

Post by VanguardLH
might become.

Post by micky
As to encryption, stunnel handles all of Eudora's encryption needs.

Yeah, I mentioned that. It can be easy to setup, or a bitch depending
on what features of sTunnel you want to implement. You use sTunnel to
patch up a discontinued/abandoned/dead product to keep it usable as the

That wasn't the case.

Post by VanguardLH
rest of the world moves on. If the program were maintained (not dead)
then sTunnel isn't needed

No. It depends what maintenance has been done.
I think you're just being annoying for the sake of being annoying.

Post by VanguardLH
(well, except for some of its other esoteric
uses).
I would have to do the same in using sTunnel with my long-dead 40tude
Dialog NNTP client if, for some I felt compelled to connect to an NNTP
that supported encryption (NNTPS). Since newsgroups are a public venue
for communication, I see no reason to encrypt my messages during
transport since they're obviously going to digestable by anyone visiting
any newsgroup to where a I submit. E-mail, however, usually has a
limited list of recipients, so it isn't intended for public consumption.

Yeah, I know, lots of folks continue to defend their choices and don't
like to face the truth. Your father (Eudora) died. Your uncle
(extensions) are paying your grocery bill. Sorry, your uncle is not
your father. We can keep going round and round on this. You simply
cannot focus on which is product and what are extensions. You want to
merge the two. I don't. I view them as separate projects.

[Piet]

Post by VanguardLH
Yeah, I know, lots of folks continue to defend their choices and don't
like to face the truth.

Which "truth"? Yours? Mine? Donald Duck's?

Post by VanguardLH
Your father (Eudora) died.

Eudora isn't my father. Nor my mother, for that matter. It's just
a piece of software that, like myself, is old but still works fine.

Post by VanguardLH
We can keep going round and round on this.

Sure. So why are you doing so, given that you believe is the truth.
You really should switch to a newsgroup about religion.

-p

[micky]

In comp.mail.eudora.ms-windows, on Wed, 4 Nov 2020 21:55:29 -0600,

Post by VanguardLH

Post by micky
In comp.mail.eudora.ms-windows, on Mon, 2 Nov 2020 23:00:09 -0600,

Post by VanguardLH

Post by micky

Post by VanguardLH
Eudora (even the OSE version) has no Unicode support.

Eudora, the real one, v7.1.0.9, does have Unicode support. There is
a Eudora plug-in, Message Viewer, that will read afaik anything in
Unicode. I've used it and it works well.

I said *Eudora* does not have Unicode support. Then you verify that
fact, but then try to deny that fact.

No, I didn't.

Post by VanguardLH
Extensions or plug-ins add a
feature that the program does NOT have.

They are still support.
If my father supports me, I'm supported. I have support.

Post by VanguardLH
Was the Message Viewer plug-in
written by the author of Eudora? If so, that would counter all the
articles that note Eudora has been long unsupported (aka dead).

Unsupported is not the same as dead. If you want to believe it is,
don't reply to my posts with that as an assumption. I may not have time
to correct you all the time.

Post by VanguardLH
Thunderbird from version 68, and earlier, had no e-mail encryption, but,
you can add an extension that adds that feature (e.g., Enigmail, not
free, subscriptionware). Extensions and plug-ins don't exist just to
duplicate the functionality already in the program they are to extend.
When Thunderbird added OpenPGP, the Enigmail extension became
superluous.

Post by micky
BTW, a couple years after Qualcomm gave up supporting Eudora, they gave
out a license number everyone and anyone can use, to use the latest
formerly paid version of Eudora.

Because they killed (discontinued)the product,

They did not discontinue the product. They discontinued development and
support of the product. Not at all the same thing.
And discontinuing their development and support is not at all the same
as killing. Try to understand that.

Post by VanguardLH
didn't want anyone to
think they would get support,

No,everyone knew that already.

Post by VanguardLH
so gave out the product key to assuage all
those users.

They did it because they are responsible, upstanding, and they didn't
want to see the product stop being used.

Post by VanguardLH
Yep, you get a key, but no support. It was nice they did
that, but they could've also provided a new version if for nothing other
than to remove the code that validates the product using a key.

6 of one, half a dozen of another.

Post by VanguardLH
They
didn't even want to touch the code, just publish a global key which was
probably a lot easier for them.

Sure. You touch the code, you may have to do a lot of testing to make
sure you didn't mess it up.

Post by VanguardLH

Post by micky
Then a couple years ago, they released the source code and anyone can
have that too, to make changes or improvements.

Yep, to make sure no one thought they provided any support. They

NO. EVERYONE KNEW THAT ALREADY.

Post by VanguardLH
divested themself of any responsibility for the product, or what it

Are you kidding? What responsibility do you imagine might have been
attributed to them. Have you read the terms and conditions? Do you knwo
how business works?

Post by VanguardLH
might become.

Post by micky
As to encryption, stunnel handles all of Eudora's encryption needs.

Yeah, I mentioned that. It can be easy to setup, or a bitch depending
on what features of sTunnel you want to implement. You use sTunnel to
patch up a discontinued/abandoned/dead product to keep it usable as the

That wasn't the case.

Post by VanguardLH
rest of the world moves on. If the program were maintained (not dead)
then sTunnel isn't needed

No. It depends what maintenance has been done.
I think you're just being annoying for the sake of being annoying.

Post by VanguardLH
(well, except for some of its other esoteric
uses).
I would have to do the same in using sTunnel with my long-dead 40tude
Dialog NNTP client if, for some I felt compelled to connect to an NNTP
that supported encryption (NNTPS). Since newsgroups are a public venue
for communication, I see no reason to encrypt my messages during
transport since they're obviously going to digestable by anyone visiting
any newsgroup to where a I submit. E-mail, however, usually has a
limited list of recipients, so it isn't intended for public consumption.

Yeah, I know, lots of folks continue to defend their choices and don't
like to face the truth.

Yeah, I feel bad for you.

Post by VanguardLH
Your father (Eudora) died.

Don't make jokes about that.

Post by VanguardLH
Your uncle
(extensions) are paying your grocery bill. Sorry, your uncle is not
your father. We can keep going round and round on this. You simply
cannot focus on which is product and what are extensions. You want to
merge the two. I don't. I view them as separate projects.

They were separate projects. Maybe they still are. That doesn't change
anything I said.

[micky]

In alt.comp.os.windows-10, on Wed, 04 Nov 2020 04:07:31 +0000, Jim H

Post by micky
Eudora, the real one, v7.1.0.9, does have Unicode support. There is a
Eudora plug-in, Message Viewer, that will read afaik anything in
Unicode. I've used it and it works well.

The one that's otherwise known as the Greek Viewer? The one available
here? If not, where is it available?
https://www.drivehq.com/web/brana/plugins.htm

Yeah, Message-File viewer, on that page. I think [assume] it was first called
Greek Viewer when all it could do was Greek.
Mickey

Thanks for confirming. I've used an older version and quit using it.
Have downloaded the newest and will try it. But I don't get mail in
any language except English with maybe a few accented letters in a few
words like Fortè. Now if it handled UTF8 that would be wonderful since
UTF8 is the only thing I really regret old Eudora doesn't have. But it
doesn't handle it, does it?

No, it does do UTF-8. It's not perfect but it's pretty darn good.

You can use Alt / View / Character encoding to set what I guess is your
default encoding.

But if it doesn't look perfect, it's quicker to change encoding
temporarily by clicking on the bottom right, to get what I assume is the
same list of choices, and then it's easy to pick one after another to
get the best one. It don't get many emails that need any of this so I
don't have much experience.

Also, it offers Unicode utf-7 and Unicode utf-8. I haven't tried to
find out the difference. Plus it offers several utf-8 languages. I
don't know what the difference between those and the first two are,
either. I know that sometimes for a foreign language, even a foreign
alphabet, choosing the language itself doesn't give as good a result as
utf-8.

Then if reading it is not enough and you want to incorporate it in the
incoming email, do ctrl-A, ctrl-C, go to the original email, click on
the pencil, select probably the whole email, and do ctrl-V, and there
you go. You can do this with email in the inbox, any other incoming
box, and also but maybe not as well with the composition window.

What works well is making a tool-bar button for View - HTML Viewer. It's
saves a bunch of clicks.
There's another icon in the edit add-on menu for View Plain Text
Version, but it seems to me so far that the HTML option handles plain
text too, so I use only that. I could ask the author what the
difference is but I doubt that I will. If you find out, let me know.

Also, the Message-Viewer window is the same size as the Message window
in Eudora, regardless of what size that is.

-

Jim H

[Carlos E.R.]

Post by VanguardLH

Post by micky
In comp.mail.eudora.ms-windows, on Sun, 1 Nov 2020 02:22:55 -0600,

Post by VanguardLH

Post by micky
I'll give you the details later, but how do I delete all my email from
all four servers I use except what came in the last 24 or 48 hours?
I used to have a program that would do this, but I don't even remember
its name.
What program will do this, preferably without actually dl'ing the email
first?
I'm a Eudora user and it will delete everything, but that will delete
mail I've gotten in the last 24 hours.

Why not use the e-mail provider's webmail client to sort the e-mails in
whatever folders are there (standard ones plus any you created) to
delete anything older than 4 months?

A very good idea. That's what I finally did, at least with fastmail.
Maybe I thought I'd have to check off each one of the 5000 instead of
All at once, and unchecking the ones I wanted to keep.
I think it was more than that. I wanted to undo whatever was happening
in Eudora. It has a Left Message on Server file, LMOS.dat, for each
server, that I thought I could manipulate, but eventually I learned it
didnt' work the way I'd speculated.
Eudora has a feature to "Delete from Server every email that is fully
downloaded". And that worked with 3 of the 4 servers, but not with
Fastmail. I tried 2 or 3 times and it had no effect, so I had to do
what you suggest above.

If you used IMAP (instead of POP), you would see the same set of e-mails
on your old (laptop) and new (desktop) computers. You wouldn't have to
store them up to have them on another computer. Anytime you install an
IMAP client on any computer to connect to your account, it sees the same
folders and e-mails you saw on any other computer. Plus you could sync
on more folders than just the Inbox (POP has no concept of folders, just
knows the mailbox where IMAP can sync on any and all folders, including
those you add to organize your e-mails).
Also, an IMAP client can immediately notified when a new e-mail arrives
without a persistent network connection to the server whereas POP won't
know until its next polling interval (and polling at less than 5-minute
intervals is considered rude to the e-mail providers). Original Eudora
is pretty old, so I don't know how well it supports the PUSH (c.2006) or
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eudora_(email_client)

I was going to say the same thing. All this problem was caused by using
pop3 instead of imap. Just a fact.